Bootylicious Batch
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Someone chuck a cupcake at meh
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Post by Bootylicious Batch on Oct 4, 2017 20:56:56 GMT
50% of statistics are made up on the spot! That's 99.9% accurate
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sam
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MOTM October '18
i'll follow you wherever you lead
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Post by sam on Oct 4, 2017 21:29:09 GMT
Even if those stats had a linked source to validate them they're not very relevant to the debate at large; deaths related to alcohol, drugs etc are self inflicted and or accidents. Some random dude shooting you with a machine gun isn't. If we can at least prevent intentional murder in the form of shootings (with weapons that imo should only be for the military and police) then it is certainly a step in the right direction. Alcoholism and drug abuse are separate issues.
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katy
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Post by katy on Oct 4, 2017 21:52:04 GMT
I don't think anything justifies any civilian owning the weapons that guy had. No reason at all for anybody to need them, other than to kill in numbers.
Saying that, I'm no lover of conspiracies but something about this Vegas shooting seems so off to me. I'm interested to see what comes out about it in the coming weeks because nothing's making a whole lot of sense at the mo. He's hardly your standard mass shooter.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 21:52:53 GMT
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BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Oct 4, 2017 23:13:10 GMT
Years ago I used to be one of those people who believed the 2nd amendment right should remain as is, despite not being a gun owner myself. I've since thought the gun laws do need to be changed and I personally don't get why anyone would feel the need to own a gun and all this other stuff you guys have said. However, going back to my mindset from back then the reason I felt that way is because I thought if we changed or completely got rid of that amendment, who's to say that other amendment rights wouldn't be next? The founding fathers established these rights for a reason, and okay back then they had slavery and women couldn't vote and all this other stuff that has since been changed. I've also always believed the 2nd amendment right was written within context for its time when you were pretty much on your own to protect yourself. Totally all valid points.
But I think many Americans believe the Constitution needs to remain as it was when it was first written because that's what the nation was founded upon. The moment you start changing stuff it's not what it originally was. And who's to say that once you go changing amendment rights that they might decide to change or get rid of something else? That was the thing I was always afraid of when I used to be more conservative in my belief with this.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 23:28:03 GMT
So what do you believe now?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 23:28:30 GMT
I think you guys should book a trip over here to the USA and let me show you around. Stay at my crib, I have plenty of room. I am a fan of anyone who is a fan of Avril. We will have so much fun and maybe we would understand each other’s view better? Please, be my guest.
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BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Oct 4, 2017 23:33:14 GMT
I believe something with the laws needs to be changed, I mean obviously there's something wrong here somewhere when these kinds of shootings keep happening and nothing has been done to try to lessen them. I also think we need to do more for mental health. That's my two cents.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 23:38:12 GMT
After all that has been said/posted some may be surprised I agree with you. But how to go about it has confounded the best of us. I really believe there would be a meltdown if “they” tried to control that right.
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ben545
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MOTM March '16 - Banned
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Post by ben545 on Oct 5, 2017 6:59:58 GMT
I don't really give a shit. I made mini-uzis for the Americans with my own hands for years. Totally impractical gun whose only purpose is to hurt people. If they want to live among weapons like this, go ahead, their funeral. Just thought America would be a nicer holiday destination without the guns. And by the way my grandad fought in the second world war, conscripted from Australia. Squadron leader of the Royal Australian Air force so don't give me any shit about Nazis. Nazis were everybody's problem.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2017 7:05:43 GMT
You don't. Just change the one that's outmoded and ambiguously-worded, and leave the rest alone. Make it so you can own a shotgun or hunting rifle if you really must, but not something you can lay down suppressing fire with. Civilians have no business owning such things, I don't care if you live in a rough neighborhood or out in the sticks. I find it interesting that a nation founded a mere 200 years ago is so hung up on tradition and will take this at face value.
Becky pointed out that it has in fact been changed since it was first written. I'm not a historian and I don't know the exact details of how these changes came about, but if you did it once then you can do it again. It's like part of the American psychology WANTS these things to be everywhere. This is why people get annoyed and start calling you rude things out of frustration and bewilderment. It just makes no sense to them.
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eismann
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Post by eismann on Oct 5, 2017 7:55:12 GMT
I think most of the mass shootings (in schools) here in Germany were done with guns the guys stole from their own parents (mostly the parents owned the guns because of shooting-sports and didnt place them in a secure storage). In cases were they didnt have this easy access to weapons they used other things (such as knifes or axes) and a lot less people were killed. Of course, if you really want to get a gun, you will find ways to get them. Especially when you are not a child/teenager but an adult with money etc. - but the easy access that you find in the US might support mass shootings. I agree with Marliz at this point.
I have never been to the US and I dont need to go there to know that you guys dont need all these guns. Everybody knows enough about the USA to form an opinion about your gun laws. I think it's just a weird education to "brainwash" people that they need guns and that it's their personal right and an expression of freedom, but I can see why it's difficult for some US-americans to understand the problematic about the gun laws when they were growing up with this "gun-progaganda". From my german point of view, it just looks weird.
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BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Oct 5, 2017 12:10:31 GMT
You don't. Just change the one that's outmoded and ambiguously-worded, and leave the rest alone. Make it so you can own a shotgun or hunting rifle if you really must, but not something you can lay down suppressing fire with. Civilians have no business owning such things, I don't care if you live in a rough neighborhood or out in the sticks. I find it interesting that a nation founded a mere 200 years ago is so hung up on tradition and will take this at face value. Becky pointed out that it has in fact been changed since it was first written. I'm not a historian and I don't know the exact details of how these changes came about, but if you did it once then you can do it again. It's like part of the American psychology WANTS these things to be everywhere. This is why people get annoyed and start calling you rude things out of frustration and bewilderment. It just makes no sense to them. I agreed with you up until your last sentence. Not understanding why a culture does something isn’t justification for calling them stupid or insulting them. Insulting another country and it’s culture isn’t going to help things get better. I’m done. I gave my 2 cents, gave the American perspective you all asked to hear. It just keeps going in circles. I don’t think either side will be convinced to change their view. I come here for Avril, I’m typically not one to engage in political debates, especially when it doesn’t go anywhere. I’m out.
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TomX
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Post by TomX on Oct 5, 2017 12:30:29 GMT
Does Avril really have political views? Other than the Las Vegas post, she's never been active on that aspect, at least not publicly.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2017 12:34:16 GMT
You don't. Just change the one that's outmoded and ambiguously-worded, and leave the rest alone. Make it so you can own a shotgun or hunting rifle if you really must, but not something you can lay down suppressing fire with. Civilians have no business owning such things, I don't care if you live in a rough neighborhood or out in the sticks. I find it interesting that a nation founded a mere 200 years ago is so hung up on tradition and will take this at face value. Becky pointed out that it has in fact been changed since it was first written. I'm not a historian and I don't know the exact details of how these changes came about, but if you did it once then you can do it again. It's like part of the American psychology WANTS these things to be everywhere. This is why people get annoyed and start calling you rude things out of frustration and bewilderment. It just makes no sense to them. I agreed with you up until your last sentence. Not understanding why a culture does something isn’t justification for calling them stupid or insulting them. Insulting another country and it’s culture isn’t going to help things get better. I’m done. I gave my 2 cents, gave the American perspective you all asked to hear. It just keeps going in circles. I don’t think either side will be convinced to change their view. I come here for Avril, I’m typically not one to engage in political debates, especially when it doesn’t go anywhere. I’m out. I didn't say it was justified, and staff don't want to see any more of it. Buuuuuuut as an 'outsider' I can totally see WHY people get weirded out and frustrated. Plenty of Americans would have much worse things to say about themselves, I'm sure.
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