BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Feb 26, 2024 22:35:19 GMT
Honestly I think it’s more that this is what she wants to make, I don’t see her pandering to anyone, and that’s what’s most concerning to me. She obviously must make what she’s passionate about but I really struggle to understand how she’s been through so much in her personal life and all she’s really got to say is “boys suck and make me sick!!”. If she wants to keep doing LS-type sounds then fine whatever, but at least have some substance behind it lyrically and in the subject matters. I can appreciate a few fun immature songs for what they are, but when it’s full albums it just loses me. Like I’m in my 30’s, as are most of her fans, I just don’t understand who she thinks her audience is? Shes making music for people having a mid life crisis at this point (I joke but also kind of don’t). Surely she has more to say on her relationships - which less be honest has been quite a messy history - than to blame it all on the guy all the time I agree but I almost wonder if she doesn’t do more raw songs because she is afraid of it. I honestly think that could be why her default is fun non serious songs or even when she does try to write something deeper, it’s very rarely super emotional. Confronting your fears or your past requires reflection, a quiet space, possibly even therapy. It is a scary and vulnerable place for many people to go psychologically. I wonder if Avril just isn’t prepared for that mentally, or she does not want to revisit painful parts of her past.
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Dillon
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Post by Dillon on Feb 27, 2024 1:05:14 GMT
If Boy at the Rock Show is a rework/cover of the blink-182 song, then that’s really no different from her recording a version of Lauren Christy’s I Want What I Want during the HAW sessions.
I think it’s just her having fun in the studio and doing different things that she has no intention of doing anything with officially.
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Dillon
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Post by Dillon on Feb 27, 2024 1:05:30 GMT
I think a big reason why Avril goes back to the drawing board and scraps songs/ideas so often is that it’s the music creation that she enjoys most. We all know she hates the promotion process and touring, she has a love/hate relationship with. So I don’t think she’s pressed about finishing her next album super quickly because she’s already feeling fulfilled by creating music even if a good portion of it gets shelved or is never intended for an album in the first place.
And while she’s about to go on this Greatest Hits tour, it’s not going to require much promotion, if any really. So she gets to skip her least favorite part. And without having a fresh new album, she has no pressure to be performing new songs that we all know she disliked having to learn new songs for tour.
She knows her peak days are behind her and that she’s financially stable without be an active, major artist who releases music/albums regularly. So I think she’s just enjoying making music with her friends and not doing much else on top of that. I think making the next new album gets less important to her with each album she puts out.
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BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Feb 27, 2024 1:26:55 GMT
All of that might be true but surely she still has obligations to the label? I don't know who's paying for everything but unless she's working out of her own studio or maybe a friend's like Travis/Feldy, surely being in these studios and stuff costs money. So she can't just go in there to goof off for as long as she feels like, eventually it's costing the label money and she needs to be doing something actually productive that will end up on an album to recoup the expenses.
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2000sclear
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Post by 2000sclear on Feb 27, 2024 2:03:26 GMT
Honestly I think it’s more that this is what she wants to make, I don’t see her pandering to anyone, and that’s what’s most concerning to me. She obviously must make what she’s passionate about but I really struggle to understand how she’s been through so much in her personal life and all she’s really got to say is “boys suck and make me sick!!”. If she wants to keep doing LS-type sounds then fine whatever, but at least have some substance behind it lyrically and in the subject matters. I can appreciate a few fun immature songs for what they are, but when it’s full albums it just loses me. Like I’m in my 30’s, as are most of her fans, I just don’t understand who she thinks her audience is? Shes making music for people having a mid life crisis at this point (I joke but also kind of don’t). Surely she has more to say on her relationships - which less be honest has been quite a messy history - than to blame it all on the guy all the time As a primarily country music fan, this lack of utilization of her very tumultuous personal history is really odd to me. I only recently became an Avril fan and I was shocked when I found out she’s had two divorces, however many boyfriends, AND Lyme disease because none of that seems to come out in the lyrics at all. With all these songwriters she works with I can’t believe none of them have gotten her to put her real feelings into some heart wrenching lyrics. I’ve seen young country singers with one relationship under their belt write infinitely more hard hitting breakup songs by themselves. Really all it would take is for a collaborator to have the balls to sit down with her and essentially like in a therapy session really dig into: {how she really feels/felt about those divorces, all those breakups, being unable to make an album for 6 years because of a disease completely out of her control, her record label not giving her much freedom on GL & pushing the album back, approaching 40 years old, etc…}. Just write down what she says during that and transform them into lyrics, surely you could get some lines out of that more substantial than “lov sux, boys suck, bite me”. And obviously the whole album doesn’t have to be those kind of songs, that’s another thing she can take from country, good country albums are a roller coaster of emotions going from drinking song to breakup song to party song to story song and everything in between. You can still have your general audience friendly singles while also having some sad stuff. And honestly the sad stuff isn’t exactly radio suicide in 2024 anyways, if you listen to the top songs right now the sad stuff is selling i.e Zach Bryan/Noah Kahan/Post Malone. She has a tight relationship with Miranda Lambert which would be a fantastic person to write those kind of songs with, but obviously if she wants to work with rock or pop songwriters there are plenty that can write depressing stuff phenomenally as well. Another thing I’ve noticed is she seems to think slow tempo automatically means sad and vice versa, that’s not necessarily the case. I think when working with somebody who’s as big as she is and been around for as long as she had it can be intimidating to try to challenge her to go outside of her comfort zone but she would really benefit from somebody doing so. Idk, that’s just my take on it from somebody who primarily listens to a lot of lyrics driven sadder music. Sorry for the long paragraph lol.
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2000sclear
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Post by 2000sclear on Feb 27, 2024 2:07:39 GMT
All of that might be true but surely she still has obligations to the label? I don't know who's paying for everything but unless she's working out of her own studio or maybe a friend's like Travis/Feldy, surely being in these studios and stuff costs money. So she can't just go in there to goof off for as long as she feels like, eventually it's costing the label money and she needs to be doing something actually productive that will end up on an album to recoup the expenses. Yeah typically artists don’t go into the studio to record unless they have at least one specific song they are happy with and want to record. Recording and producing is not an easy process at all, I doubt she would’ve gone through the effort of getting those songs recorded and produced just for shits and giggles.
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BogoGog24
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Post by BogoGog24 on Feb 27, 2024 2:13:10 GMT
Honestly I wonder if Avril feels discouraged from past experiences and that's why she doesn't seem to like going outside her comfort zone very often. She tried to go the songwriter route with GL and the label shit all over her work (some of it rightfully so, I mean it's not her best work), but she at least put in effort to try to be more serious with her lyrics and they basically wanted her to scrap it all in favor of basic pop songs anyone could do. She went through a literal divorce and was trying to write about it and they just did not care. Then when it finally came out, after she fought hard for it, it received a lukewarm response from critics and fans due to the underdeveloped writing and basic production.
With HAW she had been through a horrible disease and tried pouring that into the album, or trying new sounds like TMIO and Crush. The album is her lowest charting to date and the single was her first to debut well outside the top 40 for a lead single. It was meant to be her grand return to music after being sick and it just largely flew under the radar due to various factors. The fans didn't respond all that well to the idea of her trying new sounds. As people pointed out, LS ended up receiving a much more warm welcome since pop punk is basically her bread and butter. It's entirely possible that she just feels discouraged at this point, like basically no matter what she does she can't seem to win. Fans are tired of the same formula album after album, but then whenever she tries something new, either the label or the fans basically shit on it and say it's crap and she should just stay in her lane. Look at the response when we thought she might be doing rap or hip hop. I agree it's not her thing and probably wouldn't suit her, but fans weren't even willing to give it a chance before they immediately dismissed it. Rumor is she might be doing country and there's many fans who are against that too. There's definitely some who don't seem to want her to step outside her pop punk box at all.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2024 2:18:59 GMT
Honestly I wonder if Avril feels discouraged from past experiences and that's why she doesn't seem to like going outside her comfort zone very often. She tried to go the songwriter route with GL and the label shit all over her work (some of it rightfully so, I mean it's not her best work), but she at least put in effort to try to be more serious with her lyrics and they basically wanted her to scrap it all in favor of basic pop songs anyone could do. She went through a literal divorce and was trying to write about it and they just did not care. Then when it finally came out, after she fought hard for it, it received a lukewarm response from critics and fans due to the underdeveloped writing and basic production. With HAW she had been through a horrible disease and tried pouring that into the album, or trying new sounds like TMIO and Crush. The album is her lowest charting to date and the single was her first to debut well outside the top 40 for a lead single. It was meant to be her grand return to music after being sick and it just largely flew under the radar due to various factors. The fans didn't respond all that well to the idea of her trying new sounds. As people pointed out, LS ended up receiving a much more warm welcome since pop punk is basically her bread and butter. It's entirely possible that she just feels discouraged at this point, like basically no matter what she does she can't seem to win. Fans are tired of the same formula album after album, but then whenever she tries something new, either the label or the fans basically shit on it and say it's crap and she should just stay in her lane. Look at the response when we thought she might be doing rap or hip hop. I agree it's not her thing and probably wouldn't suit her, but fans weren't even willing to give it a chance before they immediately dismissed it. Rumor is she might be doing country and there's many fans who are against that too. There's definitely some who don't seem to want her to step outside her pop punk box at all. Honeslty that’s a good point she probably feels discouraged and doesn’t even know what To do. If I met her I’d tell her do whatever makes you happy write whatever makes you happy, I really wanna know what Avril’s version of GL would’ve been like. Also with LS I remember it coming out people were like AVRIL LAVIGNES COMEBACK ALBUM! And i was like didn’t she have 1 3 years ago? So yeah it goes to show the GA doesn’t like it when she changes and does something different. And honestly she might feel defeated. I hope I get a chance to meet her on tour and maybe talk to her
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2000sclear
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Post by 2000sclear on Feb 27, 2024 2:21:10 GMT
Blame Avril. She loves making this type of songs nowadays. It's nobody's fault but hers. Yeah but those songsget the public talking. They like those songs. HAW? TMIO> IWIM? Nobody talked or listened to them. LS came out? Everyone talked about it. Why? because it was back to her punk roots and simple. Thats what the GP ikes now a days they dont care for deep lyrics they care for beats and shit While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2024 2:26:26 GMT
Yeah but those songsget the public talking. They like those songs. HAW? TMIO> IWIM? Nobody talked or listened to them. LS came out? Everyone talked about it. Why? because it was back to her punk roots and simple. Thats what the GP ikes now a days they dont care for deep lyrics they care for beats and shit While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically. Ehh not really. Today’s generation is all about rap music and beat and whether it would go hard in a club. Trust me
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2000sclear
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Post by 2000sclear on Feb 27, 2024 2:48:30 GMT
While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically. Ehh not really. Today’s generation is all about rap music and beat and whether it would go hard in a club. Trust me I mean obviously there is a large segment that is that way, but in the past year "I Remember Everything" went #1 on the Billboard Top 100, "Fast Car" went to #2, "Stick Season" made it to the top 10. All three of those songs are well written primarily acoustic songs with no beats whatsoever and absolutely would not go hard in a club at all. All the artists/songwriters involved, with the notable exception of Tracy Chapman, (Zach Bryan, Kacey Musgraves, Noah Kahan, and Luke Combs) are in large part a product of the support of today's generation. Those songs contain a ton of killer lines including but not limited to: {"Strange words come on out of a grown man's mouth when his mind's broke" | "You're drinkin' everything to ease your mind, But when the hell are you gonna ease mine?" | "No, you'll never be the man that you always swore" | "it's half my fault, but I just like to play the victim" | "I'll dream each night of some version of you, That I might not have, but I did not lose" | "I'm split in half, but that'll have to do" | "So I thought that if I piled something good on all my bad, That I could cancel out the darkness I inherited from dad" | "You once called me forever, now you still can't call me back" | "He says his body's too old for working, His body's too young to look like his, My mama went off and left him, She wanted more from life than he could give, I said, somebody's got to take care of him, So I quit school and that's what I did" | "You got a fast car, I got a job that pays all our bills, You stay out drinking late at the bar, See more of your friends than you do of your kids"}. So to say today's generation only likes rap and club music is just not really completely accurate.
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doubtfire
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Post by doubtfire on Feb 27, 2024 7:18:29 GMT
Avril hasn’t had a top 40 hit in the US since HTNGU, 11 years ago… she should not be concerning herself with her public image and what the GP expects from her. They’re not buying her music. It also baffles me because she put up such a HUGE stink about singles being forced onto Goodbye Lullaby, but then she always says “I want a tour that is nothing but hits”… but then she doesn’t work with current hitmakers EVER. So what the hell does she want???
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2024 12:38:26 GMT
Yeah but those songsget the public talking. They like those songs. HAW? TMIO> IWIM? Nobody talked or listened to them. LS came out? Everyone talked about it. Why? because it was back to her punk roots and simple. Thats what the GP ikes now a days they dont care for deep lyrics they care for beats and shit While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically. Eh also kinda wrong cuz I’m in my 20s. Literally all my freiendes and even my sister who is 14 all they listen to is rap music. Literally during the whole tyga fiasco last year they were like “stfu who cares Tyga fire he’s so good rack city bitch” literally a friend showed me this song and it was so bad and he’s like no it’s so fire it would go so hard in a club. So basically todays generation of males do really only listen to rap music
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2000sclear
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Post by 2000sclear on Feb 27, 2024 16:44:43 GMT
While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically. Eh also kinda wrong cuz I’m in my 20s. Literally all my freiendes and even my sister who is 14 all they listen to is rap music. Literally during the whole tyga fiasco last year they were like “stfu who cares Tyga fire he’s so good rack city bitch” literally a friend showed me this song and it was so bad and he’s like no it’s so fire it would go so hard in a club. So basically todays generation of males do really only listen to rap music I’m in my 20s as well, and I will say that a few years ago I would’ve definitely agreed with you, but I’ve noticed a shift. Many people, guys and girls, I know who were essentially rap only listeners a few years ago listen to other genres more than they do rap now. I do a think a lot of it is regional though, I go to a University in the southern U.S. and so the music people listen to here is obviously going to be a little different than in like the northeast or other parts of the world. The Billboard Top 100 success I mentioned earlier though indicates that at least in the U.S. it isn’t just a regional phenomenon.
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eismann
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Post by eismann on Feb 27, 2024 16:47:41 GMT
While I think the statement that the general public these days doesn't care for deep lyrics isn't exactly true, skipping past that discussion entirely I would just like to point out that "beats and shit" and deep lyrics by no means are mutually exclusive, the best songs are strong melodically, production wise, AND lyrically. Eh also kinda wrong cuz I’m in my 20s. Literally all my freiendes and even my sister who is 14 all they listen to is rap music. Literally during the whole tyga fiasco last year they were like “stfu who cares Tyga fire he’s so good rack city bitch” literally a friend showed me this song and it was so bad and he’s like no it’s so fire it would go so hard in a club. So basically todays generation of males do really only listen to rap music This is like the 4th time you bring this argument somewhere in this forum. I am sorry that you are so hurt by your friends comments about Avril and you truly seem to hate their taste in music. That's fine, whatever. But can you stop trolling people with this nonsense argument, it's kinda annoying...
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