orangesky
Member
Join Date: Jun 25, 2015 23:10:40 GMT
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 4,643
Last Online: May 3, 2024 20:00:35 GMT
|
Post by orangesky on Jan 15, 2021 20:31:05 GMT
That song is horrendous. Even without the lyrics it's just messy. Her vocals are bad, in the second verse she's all slurred and unclear, the lyrics feel like they don't always fit the melody. It's very amateur hour.
But if she wants to pretend she's making things better by taking a song about not judging people by their appearances and instead making it about how the guy must have been a jerk and it couldn't possibly be the girl's fault then more power to her I guess. Honestly, Avril is the only one who benefits from this. This song won't be a hit and will only serve to make people want to hear the original. Avril got money to loan out the song and this singer got the honour of giving her that money
|
|
imwiththesk8erboi
Member
Join Date: Nov 3, 2020 13:35:47 GMT
Posts: 247
Likes: 812
Last Online: Mar 29, 2023 11:15:36 GMT
|
Post by imwiththesk8erboi on Jan 15, 2021 20:31:12 GMT
In a BBC Interview from October Ashnikko said this: "I screamed so loud, She's hardly cleared the use of that track to anyone since it came out in 2002. Now, I just need to know that she'll hear it."
So looks like Avril hasn't even heard the song?! Why would she give her consent without knowing how Ashnikko will change the song? She'll probably regret it if she hears it.
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 20:35:31 GMT
In a BBC Interview from October Ashnikko said this: "I screamed so loud, She's hardly cleared the use of that track to anyone since it came out in 2002. Now, I just need to know that she'll hear it." So looks like Avril hasn't even heard the song?! Why would she give her consent without knowing how Ashnikko will change the song? She'll probably regret it if she hears it. My guess is Avril was probably only told it would be a cover or that a small sample would be used or something. The artist probably went through her own management who went through Avril’s management who then discussed it with Avril, lots probably got lost in translation. I wonder if she thought Avril would not give her blessing if she knew how different it was going to be, so she possibly kept the details at a minimum.
|
|
biggerwow
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 18, 2017 21:37:25 GMT
Posts: 6,045
Likes: 11,545
Last Online: Dec 5, 2018 5:20:38 GMT
|
Post by biggerwow on Jan 15, 2021 20:58:28 GMT
Just makes me think of this lol
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 21:03:31 GMT
I know that parody law actually allows someone to make a parody of a song without permission from the artist. However, parody artists like Weird Al, who did a parody of Complicated back in the day, gets the original artist’s blessing as a courtesy and also because he doesn’t want to do a parody and then find out the artist doesn’t approve.
I wonder if this artist framed her idea to Avril’s management as a “parody” and was only informing them as a courtesy? Under parody law, she would have been able to do this without Avril’s knowledge or consent. Maybe if Avril was just told it would be a parody or rewrite of the song, but wasn’t shown any actual lyrics, that could be why she gave her permission despite not hearing the finished product. She probably also figured she could earn a few extra coins on it from the publishing rights.
|
|
imwiththesk8erboi
Member
Join Date: Nov 3, 2020 13:35:47 GMT
Posts: 247
Likes: 812
Last Online: Mar 29, 2023 11:15:36 GMT
|
Post by imwiththesk8erboi on Jan 15, 2021 21:08:34 GMT
In a BBC Interview from October Ashnikko said this: "I screamed so loud, She's hardly cleared the use of that track to anyone since it came out in 2002. Now, I just need to know that she'll hear it." So looks like Avril hasn't even heard the song?! Why would she give her consent without knowing how Ashnikko will change the song? She'll probably regret it if she hears it. My guess is Avril was probably only told it would be a cover or that a small sample would be used or something. The artist probably went through her own management who went through Avril’s management who then discussed it with Avril, lots probably got lost in translation. I wonder if she thought Avril would not give her blessing if she knew how different it was going to be, so she possibly kept the details at a minimum. You're probably right on how things went down. Or maybe someone from her team said something like that "Avril, I know you've turned everyone down who wanted to use "Sk8er Boi", but there's this young female artist from the UK, who has great potential and could be huge in the future, so it would be smart of you to give her your approval to use the song, because it'll show you have an ear for young talent and it'll ultimately attract a younger audience to you..." Just pure speculation, but I think it's a realistic scenario.
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 21:15:44 GMT
Right and I am not sure if the other writers of the song might have also had to give clearance as well. I would think if there is even 1 writer who disapproves, it won’t go forward.
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 21:20:57 GMT
Here’s a couple interesting bits I found on her Wikipedia page. I’m not even going to give my comment as to what I think as clearly some people are going to start an argument over it, so I’ll just leave it here and you can do with it what you will:
“and has clarified that her music is not intended to be comedic or parody-based.”
Ashnikko has described herself as a feminist, and has attributed discovering intersectional feminism through microblogging website Tumblr as a teenager as a turning point for her as a woman.[20][17] She has been vocal about a range of social justice issues, having spoken out about the commercialization of feminism in November 2019, while advocating for victims of police brutality through social media.[41]
|
|
Ino
Member
Unstanning Avril.
Join Date: Sept 4, 2017 1:55:57 GMT
Posts: 138
Likes: 282
Last Online: Mar 11, 2023 17:57:58 GMT
|
Post by Ino on Jan 15, 2021 21:22:44 GMT
Also, I would like to add that I'm confused at the "feminist" angle... Like she seems to put an entire guy's worth to his ability to make a girl cums and I unironically think that's actually far more "problematic" than the OG song. And it's not coming from an insecure straight guy because I'm gay and couldn't care less about sexually satisfying a woman; I just think it's not really different from the male artists (that feminists like to call out) that put a woman's worth to how fat her ass is and how much she can deepthroat a dick.
Sk8er Boi is about caring about a guy's soul more than anything else and by making clothes, appareances or people opinions a priority you might lose a shot at getting a quality partner. If the song was called Sk8er Girl and was sang by Evan Lavigne, I don't think anyone would have an issue with it. In fact it might still get praised by the same wokies because the male singer said that the most precious thing about his sk8er girlfriend is "the soul that is inside".
Anyways, if she wanted to fix* a song so bad, she could've picked something else like Paramore's Misery Business where Hayley Williams clearly slutshames a girl and calls her a whore. I think making an alternative version of that song where Ashnikko use sex to shame a guy makes more sense than doing that to a family-friendly unproblematic WW smash hit like Sk8er Boi.
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 21:31:08 GMT
Also, I would like to add that I'm confused at the "feminist" angle... Like she seems to put an entire guy's worth to his ability to make a girl cums and I unironically think that's actually far more "problematic" than the OG song. And it's not coming from an insecure straight guy because I'm gay and couldn't care less about sexually satisfying a woman; I just think it's not really different from the male artists (that feminists like to call out) that put a woman's worth to how fat her ass is and how much she can deepthroat a dick. Sk8er Boi is about caring about a guy's soul more than anything else and by making clothes, appareances or people opinions a priority you might lose a shot at getting a quality partner. If the song was called Sk8er Girl and was sang by Evan Lavigne, I don't think anyone would have an issue with it. In fact it might still get praised by the same wokies because the male singer said that the most precious thing about is sk8er girlfriend is "the soul that is inside". Anyways, if she wanted to fix* a song, she could've picked something else like Paramore's Misery Business where Hayley Williams clearly slutshames a girl and calls her a whore. I think making an alternative version of that song where Ashnikko use sex to shame a guy makes more sense than doing that to family-friendly unproblematic WW smash hit, Sk8er Boi. As I said, this is what “new wave feminism” is. Basically women are allowed to do whatever they want without consequences, apparently this is what feminism is supposed to mean these days. But I’m not allowed to say that, or else I “look bad.” And I agree the irony is that the rewritten lyrics actually seem more problematic than the original. If she wanted to fix problematic lyrics in an Avril song, she could have rewritten EBBY (bitch slut psycho babe), or GF where maybe it takes on more of a lesbian angle instead of stealing some girl’s boyfriend. Smile with the date rape line.
|
|
Ino
Member
Unstanning Avril.
Join Date: Sept 4, 2017 1:55:57 GMT
Posts: 138
Likes: 282
Last Online: Mar 11, 2023 17:57:58 GMT
|
Post by Ino on Jan 15, 2021 21:44:18 GMT
Also, I would like to add that I'm confused at the "feminist" angle... Like she seems to put an entire guy's worth to his ability to make a girl cums and I unironically think that's actually far more "problematic" than the OG song. And it's not coming from an insecure straight guy because I'm gay and couldn't care less about sexually satisfying a woman; I just think it's not really different from the male artists (that feminists like to call out) that put a woman's worth to how fat her ass is and how much she can deepthroat a dick. Sk8er Boi is about caring about a guy's soul more than anything else and by making clothes, appareances or people opinions a priority you might lose a shot at getting a quality partner. If the song was called Sk8er Girl and was sang by Evan Lavigne, I don't think anyone would have an issue with it. In fact it might still get praised by the same wokies because the male singer said that the most precious thing about is sk8er girlfriend is "the soul that is inside". Anyways, if she wanted to fix* a song, she could've picked something else like Paramore's Misery Business where Hayley Williams clearly slutshames a girl and calls her a whore. I think making an alternative version of that song where Ashnikko use sex to shame a guy makes more sense than doing that to family-friendly unproblematic WW smash hit, Sk8er Boi. As I said, this is what “new wave feminism” is. Basically women are allowed to do whatever they want without consequences, apparently this is what feminism is supposed to mean these days. But I’m not allowed to say that, or else I “look bad.” And I agree the irony is that the rewritten lyrics actually seem more problematic than the original. If she wanted to fix problematic lyrics in an Avril song, she could have rewritten EBBY (bitch slut psycho babe), or GF where maybe it takes on more of a lesbian angle instead of stealing some girl’s boyfriend. Smile with the date rape line. OMG Smile is such a mess (I still BOP to it tho) but that line was even weird to my 12 yo self. Avril isn't really the most "socially aware" out there but Sk8er Boi is really one of her most wholesome songs. It's about a teen girl refusing to care about superficiality and falling for a sk8er boi's soul. It's really the last song tumblrinas should get triggered over.
|
|
rosegold
Member
Join Date: Mar 1, 2018 16:00:42 GMT
Posts: 365
Likes: 2,181
Last Online: Nov 24, 2021 15:00:16 GMT
|
Post by rosegold on Jan 15, 2021 23:14:43 GMT
There are other songs by Avril with questionable lyrics, but not Sk8er Boi. Yes, people can make up any narrative they want about anything, but what this artist said in that interview implied the original lyrics have a certain meaning that just isn't there no matter how hard you dig for it -- that meaning isn't present without the added made up scenario by said artist. And let's get one thing straight: she is allowed to do it. She is allowed to add her own made up narrative and create a new version of Avril's song around it. It's just not fair to paint it as an attempt to fix the original lyrics because that implies that her narrative was present in the song all along. With other more vague and open songs, sure, you could argue back and forth about it being open to interpretation, but Sk8er Boi's lyrics are some of the most straightforward in Avril's discography. Avril gets teased all the time for how blunt and direct the lines in that song are, I mean, "he was a boy, she was a girl"? She really couldn't have made it more obvious.
|
|
ame · 雨
Member
Monster dressed in white
Join Date: Jan 31, 2019 16:03:38 GMT
Posts: 2,205
Likes: 4,789
Last Online: Nov 28, 2020 8:23:54 GMT
|
Post by ame · 雨 on Jan 15, 2021 23:35:23 GMT
Unpopular opnion (oh what a surprise coming from me xD) but I don't find EBBY to be problematic either...(?) maybe it's just me that it's too used to ..."violence"? IDK xD
She insults that girl, it's true. But the context of the song somehow says that the guy moved on from Avril too fast or that they were on a break (insert Ross&Rachel gif here) or something like that. But anyways, she's clearly just mad. And to be honest who wouldn't be? xD it's that irrational hate you have for the person that stole your partner. I don't see any problem in that for insulting her. (it's not morally the smartest thing to do, obviosuly but the TBDT is not about being moral anyways.) So yeah, just because she's insulting another woman shouldn't be problematic at all.
Girlfriend is another story tho xD She clearly tries to steal someone else's boyfriend LOL. I still see it as fiction. She could literally be a character from Mean Girls in Girlfriend. That's how I see it. She was just portraying a character and told the story from the perspective of the villian. It's not deeper than that. We all know it's not right to steal partners lol xD
About Smile...oof. When it came out I didn't really pay atenttion to the lyrics (i also was not that good in english) But now...it's just weird....BUT trying my best to defend her intentions and her naiveness...(and unlike sk8er boi, Smile is more open to interpretation.) I think we just got wrong the timeline in the song:
I think the first verse is about how they met and fell in love.... and yet she does say "you KNOW that I'm a crazy...." so, it's not even sure if she knew this guy or not. It's just the pre-chorus where she says "you said hey, what's your name" that makes us think she just met him. BUT as far as I'm concerned that could be just a "flashback" let's say... Anyways, They meet. They fell in love and there the second verse comes and the problematic lyrics appear. But I GUESS it COULD be that they already knew each other and just to "have some fun" her boyfriend put something in her drink to make things more spicy. It's not rare that some couples do drugs together to have some fun. Maybe he tried to surprise her LOL. What I mean is that she could be obviously talking about someone that she already knows, not so random dude in a bar. AND by the way...."what did you put in my drink?" like....maybe she was drinking whatever thing, like coke or idk, and he put alcohol in it, and that's why she blacked out.... "Drink" doesn't always mean alcohol right? i may be wrong. But anyway.
See? You can do acrobatics with the meaning of a song... if you really want to. You can basically give any song whatever meaning you want. But yeah.
|
|
BogoGog24
Administrator
I'm off again in my world...
Join Date: Mar 14, 2015 12:38:58 GMT
Posts: 14,720
Likes: 39,106
User is online
|
Post by BogoGog24 on Jan 15, 2021 23:42:05 GMT
I guess we will never know what others think of the song since she has comments turned off on her videos
|
|
orangesky
Member
Join Date: Jun 25, 2015 23:10:40 GMT
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 4,643
Last Online: May 3, 2024 20:00:35 GMT
|
Post by orangesky on Jan 15, 2021 23:49:09 GMT
I don't think Avril was literally saying her boyfriend drugged her in Smile. I think it was just a play on the common phrase "what's in this drink?" that people use when they get more drunk than they intended to and blame the drink as if it's stronger than usual rather than them just having had too much. It's the same in Baby it's Cold Outside. Avril just gets blackout drunk, from drinking too much and not being drugged, and can't remember getting his name tattooed on her. Something that really did happen to her around that time. I just don't think she was aware enough to realise there was another interpretation to that line and her kind of clunky phrasing would sound bad.
I agree EBBY is just about venting at some girl who seemingly stole her boyfriend. It's a heat of the moment thing and I don't think people should pretend to never get mad or vent just so they seem unproblematic. That's not healthy. EBBY was about capturing that feeling.
GF is worse but also kind of just a fantasy to me. She likes a guy and doesn't like his gf, thinking she would be a better match for him (a perfectly human feeling) but I can't recall the lyrics suggesting she's actually doing anything about it. I could be wrong but I remember it more as a fantasy like this guy is going to realise how great she is and dump his gf for Avril but not that Avril is going to do anything to cross a line and make that happen.
|
|